limited entry area, obsidian falls, middle sister

[beast]

Curious what the fine is for being in the obsidian falls limited entry area without permit on route to middle sister summit? If you enter the area (briefly) via the PCT trail from scott trailhead, is that a no-no?

Thanks! Hoping a permit opens up for target weekend but they are frustratingly all reserved!

Anyone else frustrated by the permits only being available online, and yet many going unused (based on past trips, even when they are all sold-out, there is often way less than the quota).

Thanks!

[retired jerry]

I've been there many times and not seen rangers

Except once I was on the PCT just out of Obsidian area. They asked to see my self issue wilderness permit. I'm sure they would have been unhappy if I wasn't following Obsidian rules.

Maybe you could do Middle Sister from Pole Creek TH?

[arundodonax]

I have run into rangers checking permits.

My understanding is that if you are only passing through (i.e. enter from another trailhead) you are fine.

[retired jerry]

On the PCT, the sign says it's okay to walk through as long as you stay within 300 feet of the PCT

I take pictures of most signs but somehow missed that one

The sign said something about fines if violated

[Chip Down]

I've had a ranger ask for my permit once. I don't mean once in that area, I mean once ever, in all my years of hiking. Your odds are slim-to-none.

Anyway, if approached, just smile politely and keep walking. There's literally nothing they can do. It's completely unenforceable. I'm assuming they're not going to handcuff you and escort you out, and I'm also confident they won't wait at the TH for you to show up.

[miah66]

Pic of the sign at the TH: https://goo.gl/photos/uWZPJZpHYLSd1sFY8

Don't listen to Chip Down. We came across two rangers in the Obsidean area near Arrowhead lake, they were cleaning up camps, removing fire rings, cutting bear hang ropes out of trees, etc. They were camped in the area and do patrols, they said. They checked our permits. If you go, stay on the PCT and do not camp in the closure area.

[Aimless]

It's true that I rarely see FS rangers out checking permits, but that is mostly because I far prefer to hike in uncrowded places. When I have seen rangers checking permits it has been on heavily used trails and in special-permit areas like Jeff Park, Obsidian and Pamelia. Do not kid yourself; when the FS sees a need to restrict entry to an area it does what it can to enforce those restrictions. If you choose to ignore the rules and try to get away with it, just realize that you are precisely the sort of person who needs to be caught and fined, because you cannot voluntarily control your selfish impulses and must be taught your lessons via painful experience.

[Chip Down]

Don't listen to Chip Down.

Wait...you mean with respect to this thread, or just in general?

Please note that that there's a post above which almost seems intended to taunt me into a battle, but I'm just a good-natured guy, and I'm going to let it slide, because I don't want things to get nasty here. I figure what we have in common is hopefully stronger that what divides us...maybe.

[miah66]

Absolutely. You're probably correct in your assumption about unenforceable regs, but I can't in good concious let that go unchallenged when I've personally had interactions with FS rangers in this exact location. No offense intended. I really enjoy your posts!