Valhalla: Amazing Geological Wonder Discovered in Oregon

General discussions on hiking in Oregon and the Pacific Northwest
Leeroy
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Re: Valhalla: Amazing Geological Wonder Discovered in Oregon

Post by Leeroy » February 14th, 2016, 1:39 pm

Can someone please explain how the footage at 2:05 (and possibly 2:54) was obtained if no drones were illegally used to film by anyone in the expedition?

https://www.facebook.com/UncagetheSoulP ... 020128899/

Doesn't it bother any of you that OFG did ALL of this without ONCE consulting with the FS? (Yes Koda, I know you want proof. There is none in print. Call the FS and ask them yourself. Better yet call a news agency and convince them to look into it. I've had no luck all week)

The FS is tasked with acting as steward of OUR lands and if a huge production crew was making multiple trips with large groups, helicopters, drones and massive amounts of gear into and out of a fragile and pristine area I'd sure as hell want the people who are supposed to be keeping an eye on OUR land to at least be aware of it. OFG's decision to thumb their nose at the FS is completely inappropriate as was their decision to turn this episode into an adrenaline fueled, reality TV show and then attempt to commercialize the entire thing. Timed the release to coincide with a pledge drive. Shame on them.

My wife and I have been donating to OPB for the last 5 years. We are done with that.

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BurnsideBob
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Re: Valhalla: Amazing Geological Wonder Discovered in Oregon

Post by BurnsideBob » February 14th, 2016, 4:59 pm

Dear Leeroy:

I'm not following your persistence in claiming OFG and the USFS have acted inappropriately re Valhalla. You also made similar statements of inappropriate action re OFG's Sandy Glacier episode.

Previously I posted a link to a press release from the USFS's Washington, DC office which states Documentary film productions do not require a Commercial Filming Permit. I did so in the hopes you and others might be informed of the actual regulations at play before you made further comments.

In regards to OFG contacting the USFS prior to conducting their film projects, each episode very publicly involved a USFS employee: Mike Malone (Valhalla) and Eddy Cartaya (Sandy Glacier). So the USFS knew about and cooperated with each filming, substantiated for the Valhalla episode by the USFS posting a Valhalla page on the web immediately upon the OFG broadcast. Just maybe drones were discussed and approved.
Leeroy wrote:if a huge production crew was making multiple trips with large groups, helicopters, drones and massive amounts of gear into and out of a fragile and pristine area
The Uncage the Soul Valhalla video you link to shows the in-canyon group's camp at minute 2:35. I see four sleeping bags and one hammock. So I'm not getting your claims that OFG violated the wilderness 12 person rule.
Leeroy wrote: The FS is tasked with acting as steward of OUR lands
Here you have something. The USFS's multiple use doctrine leaves it less effective at any of its mandates than the NPS that has but one.
Leeroy wrote:My wife and I have been donating to OPB for the last 5 years. We are done with that.
Your choice.

FWIW My extended family enjoyed the Valhalla episode, but all four voting adults of us felt it over hyped and a bit of a letdown. We will be continuing our support of OPB.
I keep making protein shakes but they always turn out like margaritas.

Leeroy
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Re: Valhalla: Amazing Geological Wonder Discovered in Oregon

Post by Leeroy » February 14th, 2016, 7:51 pm

Feel free to continue to defend OPB but you definitely do not have your facts straight. Actually reading several of the links posted in this thread, many that direct you to OPB's own website, might help if you would like to read them.

Mike Malone is retired and was acting completely outside the Forest Service in the promotion of his "discovery." I've never posted anything about the ice caves. Though Uncage the Soul's website does have public video available right now showing them launching and landing a drone within the wilderness boundary. This is illegal. This same video shows them setting up extensive camera support and movement systems directly in the glacier melt stream. This also wasn't a small scale production.

https://vimeo.com/112463397

They are using the video on their website currently as advertising. As well as the footage at 2:05 in the Valhalla advertising piece they have. It's not about the number of sleeping bags it's about HOW they got the footage. Was the camera attached to a paper airplane floating that way in the air? Watch it again and let me know what you think. Again, drones are illegal in the wilderness. On top of the fact that the operator needs to be licensed they would need a special exemption from the FAA. They do not have one. I checked.

Your referenced link above does indeed lay out the FS current position. Policy is still in flux within the Forest Service as evidenced by the multiple conflicting statements they've made on the issue in the last two years. I guess you could consider it settled. Not all share your opinion.

You are not allowed to shoot a for profit documentary within the Wilderness without the permission of the FS. Their JOB is to look after and act as steward of this land. Are you OK with a large scale film production happening in the Wilderness and they not be involved or even AWARE of it? OFG is claiming to meet the journalistic exclusion. Claiming no income as a non profit. Interesting how it was used as a fund raiser and released just ahead of a pledge drive. Seems blatantly commercial to me. The Forest Service has requested 12 times that OFG get permits for various projects. As of yet they have not applied for one. It's amazing what you can read on OPB's own website.

http://www.opb.org/news/article/media-v ... to-film-o/

Steve Bass, president of Oregon Public Broadcasting, said the proposed rule is designed to protect wilderness areas from filming that would have an adverse impact on land – like shooting a movie or commercial with large production crews and sets.

“Our journalists in there travel very light. They travel exactly as a public citizen going on a hike would travel. We’re not taking motorized vehicles in. We’re not disregarding any of the regulations of public lands,” Bass said.

OPB’s weekly TV series “Oregon Field Guide” has filmed numerous stories in wilderness areas. Producers say that over the last four years the Forest Service has asked them to apply for permits at least 12 times. The station has not yet gone through the permitting process.


http://www.opb.org/news/series/valhalla ... he-scenes/

"It takes 10 months of planning and two scouting trips.

Eight members on the Top-Side Crew, 11 volunteers and five highly trained canyoneers who used 700 feet of climbing rope and dozens of carabiners to descend 600 feet into an uncharted gorge.

They traversed countless logjams and saw 23 small waterfalls.

They rappelled nine major waterfalls, including a 40-footer and an incredible nearly 100-foot waterfall.

They accomplished all of this while carrying three days worth of gear in packs weighing 45–80 pounds, enduring water temperatures near the 40s and more slugs than they could count.

But it was all worth it to be the first to explore Valhalla."


This is all written with a sensationalist bent that turns out to be factually incorrect. They were not the first by any stretch of the imagination and they failed to uncover this publicly available webpage detailing a journey up this very canyon by CMRU...

http://corvallismountainrescue.org/medi ... earch.html

OFG has been made aware of the existence of this. I have yet to see them retract any of their sensationalist claims about their "discovery." This web page can be found by searching google for "CMRU North Fork Breitenbush River." The location and the name of the local mountain rescue group seems a fairly logical search engine query if you were tasked with finding information about this place.

https://www.google.com/#q=cmru+north+fo ... &es_sm=122

It wasn't exactly difficult to find yet OFG and Malone claim they spent "years" researching this place. What kind of research were they doing?

This wasn't one guy with a camera following a few more down a canyon. This was a big production for OFG and they clearly staged the whole thing, complete with low flying helicopters and drones, and released it at the beginning of a fund raising campaign. In other words...to make money. It's a commercial enterprise masquerading as news. Like so many other "news" sources today.

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Koda
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Re: Valhalla: Amazing Geological Wonder Discovered in Oregon

Post by Koda » February 14th, 2016, 7:59 pm

Leeroy,

just curious, since you know it was illegal why haven’t you hired an attorney to subpoena the permits or sue if they didn’t acquire one?
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Leeroy
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Re: Valhalla: Amazing Geological Wonder Discovered in Oregon

Post by Leeroy » February 14th, 2016, 8:57 pm

Koda wrote:Leeroy,

just curious, since you know it was illegal why haven’t you hired an attorney to subpoena the permits or sue if they didn’t acquire one?
You're really hell bent on making this about me aren't you?

Did you call the FS yet? That's how things get changed. Call them, write a letter, make noise on websites.

Your continued efforts to demean and minimize my concerns with your thinly veiled insults do not impress me.

I'm glad so many others posting on this site care so strongly about protecting our Wilderness. :cry:

I guess I just don't understand why OPB get's a pass on this. If a non profit hunting advocacy group wanted to buzz the wilderness to make an anti wolf/predator video with the assistance of an outside, for profit company, to use as a way to galvanize support around and raise funds for their agenda, I'm doubting everyone would be so passe about helicopters,drones and large production crews in our wilderness operating outside the approval of the FS. Maybe I'm wrong?

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Koda
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Re: Valhalla: Amazing Geological Wonder Discovered in Oregon

Post by Koda » February 14th, 2016, 9:24 pm

Leeroy wrote:You're really hell bent on making this about me aren't you?
Your bringing it upon yourself. I’m not making any claims you are. Over and over again your asking me to take action on your part, to validate your claim.... that’s not my problem, I’m not calling the FS. This is a public conversation that you choose to participate in and you keep bringing it up, I thought I had a fair question in response and was polite when I asked it... why single me out I’m not the only one replying to you. I’m not here to demean you so I apologize if my replies have come across offensive, I just want to talk about how cool the canyon is and perhaps what impact exposing it will have... but I don’t believe they filmed illegally there.
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mattisnotfrench
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Re: Valhalla: Amazing Geological Wonder Discovered in Oregon

Post by mattisnotfrench » February 14th, 2016, 9:32 pm

I guess the only remaining question here is whether or not I should put this hike in my new book before it goes to the printers! :P
Author of 101 Hikes in the Majestic Mount Jefferson Region.

Also available: Off the Beaten Trail: Fifty Fantastic Unknown Hikes in NW Oregon and SW Washington

pdxgene
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Re: Valhalla: Amazing Geological Wonder Discovered in Oregon

Post by pdxgene » February 14th, 2016, 9:57 pm

mattisnotfrench wrote:I guess the only remaining question here is whether or not I should put this hike in my new book before it goes to the printers! :P
On the cover! Think of the free publicity you'd get.... :lol:

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BurnsideBob
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Re: Valhalla: Amazing Geological Wonder Discovered in Oregon

Post by BurnsideBob » February 14th, 2016, 11:03 pm

Say, I wonder who was first to explore Valhalla?? Miners??

The North Santiam mining district, strung out along Opal Creek, is 15 air miles from Valhalla. For those not familiar, Opal Creek cut below the Columbia and 'Old Cascades' basalt flows exposing comparatively rich mineral deposits in the rock formations underneath. A 2010 LIDAR survey of the mining district revealed far more mining activity than Oregon's Department of Geology and Mining Industries (DOGAMI) had catalogued. The LIDAR maps are available for free. You can find them at http://oregongeology.org/pubs/search.php with search terms "North Santiam" and publication date 2010.

That much mining activity, rewarded with a degree of success, would have spurred prospecting in the other canyons in the area. So its plausible the South Fork of the North Fork of the Breitenbush was explored a 100 years ago.
I keep making protein shakes but they always turn out like margaritas.

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Water
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Re: Valhalla: Amazing Geological Wonder Discovered in Oregon

Post by Water » February 14th, 2016, 11:57 pm

Well I'll be a monkey's uncle, they have film of themselves breaking the wilderness act rules. How about that! But they're stewards!! Leeroy, you're spot on presenting the hypothetical about if it was an anti-wolf, pro hunting, pro-resource extraction org using the same means, as far as the wrath that would incur.
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