Strange experience at Frog Lake Day Use area

General discussions on hiking in Oregon and the Pacific Northwest
turtleboy133
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Joined: April 27th, 2015, 1:29 pm

Strange experience at Frog Lake Day Use area

Post by turtleboy133 » June 2nd, 2021, 8:01 pm

I stopped by Frog Lake Day Use area to have lunch on my way back to Portland from a trip to Eastern Oregon. As I was pulling in and putting up my Interagency Pass (i.e., America the Beautiful), someone wearing a shirt that said "Mount Hood Info" (or something similar, I can't recall but recognized the name as a local tourism agency or board) came up to me and told me I needed to pay $10 for a parking permit. He had a parking permit in his hand, but I told him that I already had a valid pass (i.e., my Interagency Pass). He looked at it and told me that they only accepted the US Forest Service pass or I could pay him. He was very insistent and gave me a bit of a creepy vibe. While I considered just ignoring him, I didn't want to end up with some sort of confrontation. I decided to move on and find a different area to stop for lunch.

I'm pretty positive that they are require to accept an interagency pass anywhere a NW pass is accepted. Has anyone had a similar experience? Is there usually someone down at Frog Lake Day Use area checking passes or was this guy giving me a "shake down"?

squidvicious
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Location: Troutdale

Re: Strange experience at Frog Lake Day Use area

Post by squidvicious » June 2nd, 2021, 8:36 pm

Unfortunately,
The following concession operated sites honor Northwest Forest Day or Annual Passes ONLY. Senior Pass, Access Pass, or any other Recreation Passes are NOT accepted...
https://www.fs.usda.gov/detail/mthood/p ... rdb5182336

johnspeth
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Re: Strange experience at Frog Lake Day Use area

Post by johnspeth » June 3rd, 2021, 5:01 am

The problem with these concession operated sites is that they have the appearance of something other than legitimate even though they may be legit. For example, at Trillium Lake two summers ago, I was stopped at a road block requiring me to pay $5 to proceed. Forget that the road goes to places other than Trillium Lake and that there are other less convenient roads to Trillium Lake.

How are we to trust that the persons demanding our money are true authorized agents of the USFS?

Webfoot
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Location: Troutdale

Re: Strange experience at Frog Lake Day Use area

Post by Webfoot » June 3rd, 2021, 9:04 am

squidvicious wrote:
June 2nd, 2021, 8:36 pm
Unfortunately,
The following concession operated sites honor Northwest Forest Day or Annual Passes ONLY. Senior Pass, Access Pass, or any other Recreation Passes are NOT accepted...
https://www.fs.usda.gov/detail/mthood/p ... rdb5182336
Damn, that's a lot more sites than I realized. I better mark these on my map before I get into trouble.

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naturallog
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Joined: February 2nd, 2016, 9:07 pm
Location: Portland, OR

Re: Strange experience at Frog Lake Day Use area

Post by naturallog » June 3rd, 2021, 4:30 pm

Webfoot wrote:
June 3rd, 2021, 9:04 am
squidvicious wrote:
June 2nd, 2021, 8:36 pm
Unfortunately,
The following concession operated sites honor Northwest Forest Day or Annual Passes ONLY. Senior Pass, Access Pass, or any other Recreation Passes are NOT accepted...
https://www.fs.usda.gov/detail/mthood/p ... rdb5182336
Damn, that's a lot more sites than I realized. I better mark these on my map before I get into trouble.
Furthermore, make sure you click the link to the day use site you're interested in to see exactly what you owe. The link above says you need to pay $5 per vehicle per day if you don't have a NWFP, but if you click the link for Frog Lake, it says the fee is $10. Love that for us.

turtleboy133
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Joined: April 27th, 2015, 1:29 pm

Re: Strange experience at Frog Lake Day Use area

Post by turtleboy133 » June 3rd, 2021, 7:23 pm

This makes a lot more sense to me. I did not realize that Frog Lake Day Use area was a concession-operated site. The signage was pretty poor and did not indicate that it was run by a concessionaire. Further, if you go to the information page for the Frog Lake Day Use area it indicates it's operated by the Forest Service (https://www.fs.usda.gov/recarea/mthood/ ... ecid=53106).

Also, you'd think the signage would make it clear that other recreation passes are not accepted since the advertising for these recreation passes generally indicates that recreation passes covers the NW Forest pass).

No harm done, though. We ended up going back to the sno-park parking area and hiked along the PCT for a bit, found a spot for lunch and then returned to the car.

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dirtman
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Re: Strange experience at Frog Lake Day Use area

Post by dirtman » June 4th, 2021, 9:39 am

I drove through the day use area last Saturday (Memorial Day weekend) and it was packed with people fishing. There was a person in a golf cart talking to some people who just arrived so that must have been the fee collector. We decided the crowded little lake was not for us and found various secluded scenic spots for boondocking / hiking between hwy 35 and Dufur.

squeakytree
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Joined: November 1st, 2017, 6:55 am

Re: Strange experience at Frog Lake Day Use area

Post by squeakytree » June 10th, 2021, 12:23 pm

The agreement these concessionaire's make in their contract is with the Forest Service on a local or regional level. I believe they get some sort of monetary amount when people are parked using the Forest Service Pass. Because they have no agreement with the National Park Service or any other agency, they can't recoup any money out of the Interagency Pass, so they don't accept it.


As for charging you a fee to drive through, this is absolutely ILLEGAL on the part of the concessionaire. They aren't allowed to block a public road, stop you, or ask for money just to drive through. This particular concessionaire was told this several times by Federal law enforcement at Mt Hood; not sure if that stopped them or if they continued doing this just to see if they could extract money from people who weren't aware of the regulations.

Webfoot
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Location: Troutdale

Re: Strange experience at Frog Lake Day Use area

Post by Webfoot » June 10th, 2021, 2:22 pm

squeakytree wrote:
June 10th, 2021, 12:23 pm
As for charging you a fee to drive through, this is absolutely ILLEGAL on the part of the concessionaire.
Where is that written?

squeakytree
Posts: 12
Joined: November 1st, 2017, 6:55 am

Re: Strange experience at Frog Lake Day Use area

Post by squeakytree » June 10th, 2021, 8:21 pm

Most contracts for concessionaire's are related to facilities and use areas, not roads accessing a site unless it's solely an entrance to the site. The contracts have a section stating that the permit holder may charge the public fees only to the extent that the Forest Service can charge recreation fees under REA, and that all the recreation fees must be specified per recreation site. So they can't just randomly charge you a fee to drive through if it's not posted, and they certainly can't do it if the Forest Service isn't allowed to.

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