lost in the cold rain...

[Koda]

just spent a few days elk hunting in the coast range. It was kinda nice Saturday and early Sunday but by days end Sunday the rain came in full effect and it poured non stop like a monsoon from then on, temps in the upper 30's low 40* range depending I'm guessing. We spent most of our time off trail in deep draws and of course heavy brush, I have good waterproof breathable and silent clothes but still get very damp inside from the exercise and perspiration... eventually you just get wet, everything gets wet.... if you stop moving for a while you'll freeze.

Back at camp our raging campfire was started with a cup of whitegas and dry plywood scraps (do not try this...)

At the main road into the area we hunted there was a sign about a lost hunter last seen in what 07, (the sign was there last year too). I thought about survival out there...

I recall about a year ago a thread about surviving and being prepared where we talked about being prepared and surviving an un-planned night out and we teased about going out and 'practicing'..... I thought about that and said no way will I ever volunteer to try to camp overnight, in the rain, soaked and no shelter. The fun topic of what to do I contemplated for the weekend and realize for me anyways that in this terrain or scenario getting lost or injured is not an option.

The conditions: near freezing night temps, heavy monsoon like coastal rain. What would you do if stuck overnight?

[TJ_T]

BLM Rd 32?

[Crusak]

Yes, Koda! With the return of cold, wet weather this week I was just thinking about that "fun" topic from that previous PH discussion.

How to plan an unplanned overnight outing? It might be more "fun" to do that in a small group (four people?) I dunno. I might want to just do it solo. That way I wouldn't have to listen to anyone but myself whining about the conditions.

I remember talking about just trying to get a fire going with the normal items we carry in our packs...

Let's see. I carry a windproof lighter. flint/steel striker. Stormproof matches (a whole bunch of 'em). Regular matches. Trioxane bars (the military kind). I have a 6" folding Gerber saw. 21st Century Ka-bar Knife. Leatherman multi-tool (one that has a small saw blade). Coghlan's Emergency Tinder (they look like drum shaped ear plugs... wax and cotton things that you pull apart and light). That's my fire making kit. Always in my pack, even in summer.

extra clothing - socks, underwear, long sleeve shirt, balaclava, stocking hat, gloves and wool buff. Fleece vest. Marmot windshirt with hood. I wear rain pants/coat and long underwear when hiking, along with a Gore-tex rain hat. In winter I also either wear or carry gaiters and I bring my Kahtoola Microspikes. In summer I don't always take the fleece vest.

Always got the first aid kit, custom stocked. And duct tape.

I always have 50' of small rope and a 5x7 mylar faced emergency tarp in my pack - the famous Crusak Red Tarp for Tarping Out. I have a 13-gallon plastic trash bag.

I carry a bottle of iodine water treatment tablets, and about twenty of those chlorine based water treatment tablets. Some hikes I've carried my water filter as well.

I bring a ton of food on day hikes - usually it amounts to a gallon size zip lock bag stuffed with food. Too much food, yes. Mixture of different kinds of food, including nuts, protein/energy bars, frut & nut bars, fruit leather, pop tarts, jerky, cheese sticks, Pringles (salt & vinegar), GU energy packets, a couple of Airborne tablets (those things that dissolve in water), a small container of salt, spare parts for my drinking bladder (cap & mouthpiece).

Multiple light sources, including a Mammut Lucido X-zoom headlamp, SureFire 6PX Pro Flashlight and keychain LED light.

Okay, I could have spared all of you with that long read by just saying "I am a chronic over-packer" lol.

Could I do okay overnight on an unplanned event? Probably. I've considered trying it, even if I just parked my truck in the Coast Range and tarped out nearby (without cheating by foraging inside the truck for supplies). It's fun to ponder, but I'm not sure if I want to give it a go or not. When I mentioned it to my wife she thought I'd truly gone off the deep end.

[Koda]

no no no Crusak, I do not want to plan an un-planned overnighter.
I remember when I thought of this topic in camp I just laughed inside at that thought of just going over there under a tree and wrapping up in a space blanket in the cold driving rain for the night. I'm kinda convinced the only real survival need here is some kind of shelter, like a 1 person tarp. (The Six Moon Designs Gatewood Cape comes to mind). But I recall from last year that being prepared to camp really isn't surviving in the true sense of 'survival'.... so I think being prepared in some sense is in order, that means there is two fronts to the topic, 1) how to be prepared for an emergency and 2) how to survive when your not...

[Eric Peterson]

I've got a automatic lighter thing that I've never tested or practiced lighting. I also carry
a lot of storm proof matches. I was carrying a hooded tarp/space blanket for awhile
after the famous CrusTarp hike, but have started to leave it home. Probably will
add it back into the pack for winter. I'm pretty sure I carry enough food to stay well fed
for at least 1 night and the next day. I barely eat while hiking but I pack a huge food
store with me and end up just eating it on the way home since I didn't have to
spend that unplanned night in the cold wet woods. With a extra dry heavier jacket
that's always packed in winter and a dry pair of pants and shirt/socks, I think wrapping
up in under the dry waterproof space blanket would do the trick. Put the winter hat on
and have the G-Tex Seattle Sombrero as well. Go to sleep and wait for a flash flood
to carry you away to safety!

I don't think it would hurt to practice a planned unplanned night in the wet woods, just
don't do it too far from the car or you might have to call Lurch.

While your out there, practice some of that compass orienteering too!

In the dark.

[retired jerry]

Coast range has to be about the wettest place

Good luck starting a fire. Better to climb into sleeping bag inside tent.

[Crusak]

Coast range has to be about the wettest place

Good luck starting a fire. Better to climb into sleeping bag inside tent.

Exactly. I've started fires in some very wet conditions over the years, but in the Coast Range we found that even if we got a good fire started it was difficult to keep it going for a long period of time. The rainfall and high humidity just make it tough. I remember reading 'Undaunted Courage' (Lewis & Clark expedition story by Stephen Ambrose) and they had a really though time keeping the smoke houses going in Astoria, due to the wet, humid conditions.

Unfortunately on a day hike most of us don't take a tent and sleeping bag. I suppose EP said it best - layer up, wrap up in that reflective tarp, and ride it out.

If one were not injured, and able to forage for wood, you could conceivably get to some burnable wood. Tearing open old logs, using tree sap and evergreen boughs, etc. would help get things moving along. If you got lucky you might find some wood in a heavily sheltered area (like under a rock overhang). It would be a lot of work, and your fire would be quite smoky. At least all that effort would help keep you warm. Don't plan on getting more than an hour of sleep at a time all night... Reminds me of a Gilligan's Island episode, "must keep the tiki torches lit..." (there I'm definitely showing my age)

[kepPNW]

Foraging for semi-saturated wood? Seems you'd get wetter that way, and probably not compensate for that (if you could get it lit), over just putting on dries and getting under a tarp?

When I mentioned it to my wife she thought I'd truly gone off the deep end.

Okay, hands-up, how many have had that same reaction to ideas "inspired" here?

[Lurch]

Woot! Fun topic, I don't know how I missed this one until now

The main thing that's going to determine your fate in a legitimate survival situation is going to be your attitude, and you drive to live through the night.

For the majority of situations, my main survival priority is going to be shelter, then fire or water depending on the season and conditions, and food is way down on the list..

If you've got the gear and you're insulated enough you're going to put yourself worse off by trying to get a fire going than just getting a shelter up and crawling inside. I always have a couple 55 gallon "contractor" extra heavy garbage bags with me that can work as a quick poncho or instant shelter, and have the materials to build a proper one as well.

Being able to make a legitimate shelter that will hold up and keep you dry is a skill that takes practice and something everyone should know IMHO.

You should NOT keep moving though. It's only going to make finding you harder. Especially if you're off trail..

[forestkeeper]

Hey Crusak, you know how warm it is in one of those emergency red tarps, don't you? Did you stay warm?

FK