On a similar topic... lightweight gear choices?

[Crusak]

Karl posted about making the choice between cooking and no-cook meals, in part as a way to lighten up his gear. Good discussion.

I've got a bigger problem: the 45 pound pack has got to get smaller. Cooking or not cooking won't reduce my pack weight enough. Unfortunately when discussing lightweight backpacking I always feel like it's all about sacrifice. Either you're sacrificing gear to save weight, or sacrificing $$$$ to buy super light gear.

I have a couple of lightweight shelters to choose from, both are under 2 lbs including ground sheet and stakes. I can't afford a cuben fiber shelter.

I also have some very light, packable sleeping bags (800 fill down, 30° bag is probably the best all around) but sometimes the lighter bag isn't warm enough and i freeze to death.

So... I'm curious about what you all do to save on pack weight? What gear items do you consider to be so important that you'll never leave them at home?

[Koda]

The way I do it is start with only the baseweight items. Then I add only the extra layer of clothing I might need then fill the pack up with the required amount of food and water.

If there isn’t any room left over in the pack then I don’t need it...

Or if there is room for something then I don’t go over 30lbs total pack weight….

I've got a bigger problem: the 45 pound pack has got to get smaller.

There are some variables, this is a rough formula…. (30lbs is my MAX benchmark...)

The only things besides the baseweight items I consider so important to never leave behind are the ten essentials and TP. Everything else IS a luxury. My suggestion is to rethink your benchmark.

[texasbb]

When I traded my old, heavy gear for new, lighter stuff, I was able to knock 9 lbs off my big 4. It sounds like you've already done that, at least with your tent and bag. What's your pack weigh? It's usually an easy 3 or 4 lb savings to switch from a traditional hauler to something more reasonable (I went to a ULA Catalyst, which is still a solid 3 lb). If you've already done that, too, then I'm guessing you carry a LOT of stuff you don't need.

I'm not UL by any stretch, with a base weight in the neighborhood of 18-21 lb, depending on the season/conditions, so I can do 5-day summer trips in the 30-lb range. I could get that down a bit more if I'd lose some height.

So...what are you carrrying that adds up to that extra 15 lb? Camera gear? Chair? Firearm? Too much food? Frying pan? GPS? Emergency beacon? Footprint? Daily change of clothes?

[Aimless]

If, as you say, the 45 lb pack has got to get smaller, then you're going to have to make some changes. Even if those changes strike you as sacrifices, then either you need to make the necessary sacrifices, or else the 45 lb pack will stubbornly stay at 45 lbs.

Having got that out of the way...

The first place I advise people to look when they need to lighten up is their clothing. I wear the same pants and shirt every day of a hike. For me, clean skin is more important than clean clothes, so I wash myself before supper each night. I bring just enough clothes that, if I wear everything I brought, I can stay warm when I sit around in camp at the chilliest temps that are likely to happen. The only 'extra' clothes I bring are a change of socks. For trips more than a couple of days I wash my dirty socks when I wash myself, wear the clean ones, then repeat as necessary. Some people can save several pounds right away by reducing their clothes to the prudent minimum for warmth and safety.

The next thing to look at are the "just in case" items. Most people bring many items they never use, but they feel they need them "just in case". It pays to get tough on those freeloaders. Items that are not meant exclusively for emergency use, that consistently don't get used should probably go. You aren't deriving any real comfort from them, only psychological comfort. It is lighter to cope with your psyche directly than to carry it around on your back.

Then there are the "fun stuff" items. Everyone should bring some stuff that helps them have fun, but sometimes you can bring too much fun and be miserable because you had to schlep all that fun up too many feet of elevation gain for too many miles.

Once you've pruned and pared, which costs no money, then you can turn your attention to replacing heavier items with lighter ones that do the same job just as well. But that can run $$$, so it is usually better to start with pruning first.

I wish you great happiness with your soon-to-be 25 lb pack.

[Crusak]

It's amusing, because since I started hanging out with people from Portland Hikers my day hiking trips have dominated all of my time, and I haven't done much backpacking. And in recent years my "backpacking" trips have been more like the much maligned "camping" trips discussed in another thread (low mileage recliner backpack trips). I haven't had to worry much about pack weight.

Now, after doing the 26+ miles on the Broken Top loop with Karl I realize that if I'm going to be going 8-10 miles or more per day, weight really does matter.

I have two packs suitable for backpacking, and they are very old, and very heavy. Certainly I need to get something lighter to replace my packs, which I purchased 15-20 years ago. I like some of the ideas presented by you all so far. On the Broken Top loop I only brought one pair of pants. I had smartwool thermals to sleep in, and a sleeveless t-shirt as an extra layer. I brought an old-school poncho in case it rained (that only weight 12 oz). One change of underwear, and one extra pair of socks.

The first place I advise people to look when they need to lighten up is their clothing. I wear the same pants and shirt every day of a hike. For me, clean skin is more important than clean clothes, so I wash myself before supper each night. I bring just enough clothes that, if I wear everything I brought, I can stay warm when I sit around in camp at the chilliest temps that are likely to happen. The only 'extra' clothes I bring are a change of socks. For trips more than a couple of days I wash my dirty socks when I wash myself, wear the clean ones, then repeat as necessary. Some people can save several pounds right away by reducing their clothes to the prudent minimum for warmth and safety.

The next thing to look at are the "just in case" items. Most people bring many items they never use, but they feel they need them "just in case". It pays to get tough on those freeloaders. Items that are not meant exclusively for emergency use, that consistently don't get used should probably go. You aren't deriving any real comfort from them, only psychological comfort. It is lighter to cope with your psyche directly than to carry it around on your back.

I wish you great happiness with your soon-to-be 25 lb pack.

I have a 20 year accumulation of "toys" and "accessories" that seem to end up in my pack. I suppose that's where I need to take a close look to see what I'm not using. Things like a 'repair kit' in a mesh bag (6 oz) and a small fixed blade knife (also 6 oz). I had a portable power battery to recharge the cell phone (pretty beefy). I might start with evaluating every item, and if I feel that I absolutely must bring it, try to find a replacement that weighs a lot less.

I'm surprised at how many people who don't bring a change of clothes. This last hike was the first one I've ever done where I didn't bring at least one change of clothes.

When I traded my old, heavy gear for new, lighter stuff, I was able to knock 9 lbs off my big 4. It sounds like you've already done that, at least with your tent and bag. What's your pack weigh? It's usually an easy 3 or 4 lb savings to switch from a traditional hauler to something more reasonable (I went to a ULA Catalyst, which is still a solid 3 lb). If you've already done that, too, then I'm guessing you carry a LOT of stuff you don't need.

I'm not UL by any stretch, with a base weight in the neighborhood of 18-21 lb, depending on the season/conditions, so I can do 5-day summer trips in the 30-lb range. I could get that down a bit more if I'd lose some height.

So...what are you carrrying that adds up to that extra 15 lb? Camera gear? Chair? Firearm? Too much food? Frying pan? GPS? Emergency beacon? Footprint? Daily change of clothes?

haha my wife insisted that I should bring a firearm. But I didn't see the need. I had a 15 oz. thermarest z-rest pad as a "chair" that worked great. My total cookset weight is 7 oz. I like your suggesting of getting a more modern, lighter pack. I need to look into that.

If there isn’t any room left over in the pack then I don’t need it...

There are some variables, this is a rough formula…. (30lbs is my MAX benchmark...) The only things besides the baseweight items I consider so important to never leave behind are the ten essentials and TP. Everything else IS a luxury. My suggestion is to rethink your benchmark.

I like that idea, "if I don't have it I don't need it" - I've heard that more than once before.

If I'm ever again going to try to do a trip like the last one I need to lighten up. If I don't, whoever I'm hiking with will get really tired of all my whining, huffing 'n' puffing, and complaining.

[raven]

Sleeping warm at minimum weight:

Usually a simple crawl in bivy bag adds more warmth to a sleeping bag than can be imagined. I suspect it is mostly in stopping heat loss through a zipper. If your shelter is breezy, look no further.

The bivy must have a minimum of impermeable material though -- just where the sleeping pad is -- or condensation from within becomes a pain. This can be a six ounce investment that incidentally protects your sleeping bag from tent condensation. Or you can buy some 1443 tyvek from a kite shop, take some tyvek tape (or packing tape) and make one to try.

The second point about warmth is to be sure that you have enough insulation below you. Remember snow is an insulator, so you can need more insulation on damp or frozen bare ground or rock than on snow when it gets cold enough.

[raven]

BTW,

Weigh your old pack and compare it to a replacement. Probably cannot save 3 pounds that way. So why don't you replace the pack last?

[kelkev]

Jim, I feel your pain. I've seem to have given up backpacking the past several years for day hikes, and for a few years, I was doing several 12, 15, and 18 mile round trip day hikes before I started having some chronic foot issues. I kind of got away from backpacking because lugging 45lbs on my 140 pound, 6' frame wasn't much fun. Matter of fact, it wasn't any fun on trips like the steep trudge up to Ice Lake in the Eagle Cap Wilderness.

I've gotten the "looney" day hikes out of my system (most of them), so I need to find a way to lighten my loads to make backpacking trips easier and more enjoyable as I approach 50 years of age. And losing pack weight just makes plenty of sense.

Let us know what you end up doing, gear and weight wise - - I'm curious, and inspired!

Kevin

[Koda]

For me I did have to buy new gear and some of it was expensive. I replaced my pack, my shelter, sleeping pad, water filter.

My old pack wasnt really old it was a very nice North Face Terra 55L but it weighted about 4lbs. I switched to a Granite Gear 60L pack that weighed 2.5lbs... still too big and heavy so then I bought a Gossamer Gear Gorilla 46L pack well under 2 lbs. For packs I set my benchmark at 2 lbs.

I never did replace my sleeping bag. My old bag is 0degrees and weighs just under 3.38lbs. What I want is a Western Mountaineering 0deg bag which weighs 2lbs, cuts that weight in half but for 600 bucks.... ouch.

I did splurge on my shelter. I went from a 5lbs tent to a 2.75lb 2 man tarp with bug net. Wasnt cheap but worth it. Six Moon Designs Haven silnylon.

Sawyer Mini water filter. Cheap, Just get it... get some soft water bottles too...
Thermarest Neo Air. So worth the price.

So at some point I decided I had to upgrade perfectly good gear for new UL gear. My baseweight went from about 18lbs to 10.5 lbs. The other thing about UL gear is they sometimes take up less room, volume is another gain here too, especially sleeping bags.

While back we had an excellent thread on cheap but quality baseweight gear that fit the UL dept....

http://www.portlandhikers.org/forum/vie ... 15&t=10531

[forestkeeper]

Nice thread!