Wrongful Death Lawsuit Filed over Mt Hood Fatality

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Water
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Re: Wrongful Death Lawsuit Filed over Mt Hood Fatality

Post by Water » May 16th, 2018, 3:08 pm

Bosterson wrote:
May 16th, 2018, 11:55 am
But who knows - look at the nuclear option the USFS is proposing for Central Oregon due to their management's personal opinion about increased usage.
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VanMarmot
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Re: Wrongful Death Lawsuit Filed over Mt Hood Fatality

Post by VanMarmot » May 16th, 2018, 3:38 pm

Bosterson wrote:
May 16th, 2018, 11:55 am

Of course, the real issue is that Mt. Hood is a mountain on top of a ski resort, the south side is packed with people who have just walked off a ski run, and presumably that sets up an expectation of rescue. Look at the usage of all the other routes on the mountain - they're effectively empty. Maybe the USFS will ban all climbing from Timberline (how would they enforce that??), though potentially that would just drive the less experienced into terrain that would more surely kill them... And the internet does not need any additional help accomplishing this.
I too doubt the USFS would actually ban or even severely restrict climbs of Hood's South Side. As you say, how would they enforce it? So that was just my hypothetical.

I did, however, read the HCN article you linked to. One of several I've seen (not to mention the ever enlightening Accidents in North American Mountaineering). Maybe social media helps fuel unrealistic expectations but I think this unrealism goes back to when the first tourist brochure or guidebook was written to encourage not discourage visiting the out-of-doors. There may be cautionary language in these but the dominant theme is ...you'll have a great time [and nothing really bad will happen].

Maybe my ever increasing senescence is why it's becoming increasingly difficult for me to distinguish some people's expectations for a hike or climb from those that they'd have for a trip to Disneyland. What, a hike or climb should be fun & exciting & unique enough to impress friends & relatives (in person or via social media) but not actually dangerous? Encounters with Nature (and the laws of physics) should be exciting and entrancing and "wild", but never actually disabling or fatal? And if something goes wrong (for whatever reason), a timely, safe, happy-outcome rescue is always for sure. Really? Well, sh*t can always happen and it does, so maybe it's time for some expectation management? Or golf?

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Re: Wrongful Death Lawsuit Filed over Mt Hood Fatality

Post by Bosterson » May 16th, 2018, 4:22 pm

VanMarmot wrote:
May 16th, 2018, 3:38 pm
Well, sh*t can always happen and it does, so maybe it's time for some expectation management?
I read that and it was a sad story (I actually recall reading about one of the previous people who had died going down Capitol - the person who tried to find the "shortcut" down the N face), but loose blocks kill people regularly. It's a feature of the alpine. But yeah, what it seems like Social Media is mostly accomplishing is the smoothing of everything together into one sick Instagram feed of crushable gnar, prime for living your best life. It sounded like the guy who died may have been somewhat experienced, but potentially what was missing was just knowing what they were signing up for, and/or the self-knowledge about where their personal line was, and what they were really competent to handle. Those are skills you get with experience, but are hard to learn gradually if the internet tells you that all objectives are doable and the same.

Really, the main issue is probably just that more people are going places, period. Statistically, more total people will then be killed by loose blocks. And it turns out that maybe increased usage isn't actually building a larger coalition to protect the outdoors after all. (HCN has all the hard hitting articles this week!)
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retired jerry
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Re: Wrongful Death Lawsuit Filed over Mt Hood Fatality

Post by retired jerry » May 16th, 2018, 4:53 pm

Good article

"In fact, there’s evidence from a diversity of studies (in the U.S., Japan, Europe and elsewhere) that place attachment may be the only thing that cuts across socioeconomic divides to predict environmentally friendly behavior. At least some of this research has also found that dedicated, regular participation in outdoor recreation can help us develop this connection. This gives me hope that a different outdoor recreation culture, one that emphasized the pleasure of knowing the wild nearby, could be a powerful force in building these links. For as much as we need arguments for self-willed nature that invoke Wallace Stegner’s “geography of hope” and the spiritual reserves of wilderness beyond the horizon, we also need daily practices that form bonds with places that are the backdrops to our lives."

If people spend more time in the wilderness, they'll know it better and then want to protect it. For itself.

It's not that we should preserve the wilderness just to provide recreation.

At least that what makes sense to me.

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Re: Wrongful Death Lawsuit Filed over Mt Hood Fatality

Post by drm » October 15th, 2021, 9:48 am

It's important to remember that these lawsuits are often by family members who may not be wilderness travelers. The unfortunate victims in these accidents who may well understand the risks and accept them, are not the ones suing if they did not survive.

And from what I have read in some cases, if you survive with serious injuries and your health insurance company wants to sue, you may not have a lot of choice in the matter.

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