Crater lake morons

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markesc
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Crater lake morons

Post by markesc » May 30th, 2016, 3:04 pm

Yet another example of the "rules don't apply to me" generation:

http://www.kptv.com/story/32096767/two- ... ke-caldera

More here:

http://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-north ... river_home

Fine the HELL out of 'em:

"...They were both cited for "entering a closed area" and "creating or maintaining a hazardous condition," said Marsha McCabe, spokeswoman for Crater Lake National Park..."

mreha
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Re: Crater lake morons

Post by mreha » May 30th, 2016, 8:00 pm

markesc wrote:Yet another example of the "rules don't apply to me" generation:

http://www.kptv.com/story/32096767/two- ... ke-caldera

More here:

http://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-north ... river_home

Fine the HELL out of 'em:

"...They were both cited for "entering a closed area" and "creating or maintaining a hazardous condition," said Marsha McCabe, spokeswoman for Crater Lake National Park..."
Pretty sure they'll have to pay for the rescue, which will be astronomical...although to be fair, stupidity doesn't seem to be confined to any particular generation.

Webfoot
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Re: Crater lake morons

Post by Webfoot » June 1st, 2016, 5:36 pm

The rule violation of the two requiring rescue is aggravating, but the foolishness and malice of the OregonLive comments is outright depressing. I am reminded of the saying "The best argument against democracy is a five minute talk with the average voter." :(

Steve20050
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Re: Crater lake morons

Post by Steve20050 » June 4th, 2016, 3:22 pm

Well let's see. What Have I done over the years in the enjoyment of the outdoors....

Have I ever ventured down into the caldera at Crater Lake, ahhh... well, yes I did. Went down into the crater to get one of those prohibited captures. :o

Ever hiked into another closed area, from say fire? Ahhhh... well yes, actually I have.... Camped in a no camping area? Ahhhhhh...Hot potted in Yellowstone??? :shock:

Hmm.... how about drugs and the outdoors? Does dropping window pane and hiking back into canyons when I was young and foolish count? Ahhh, Well :oops: , then yes I guess I have.

How about growing marijuana in the federal forest? I plead the 5th on that one.. :cry: .

Search and rescue? Well, once but I wasn't stoned.. ;) and managed to walk out before being found near the trailhead.

To me it is one of those glass house issues. Yes, they shouldn't have done this. One hopes they learn their lesson and are better educated in the future about our great places outdoors. I have been an idiot about some issues in regards to outdoors and the past, but have learned albeit slowly sometimes. My love of the outdoors has helped me a great deal in my life.

Lurch
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Re: Crater lake morons

Post by Lurch » June 5th, 2016, 10:45 am

mreha wrote:Pretty sure they'll have to pay for the rescue, which will be astronomical...although to be fair, stupidity doesn't seem to be confined to any particular generation.
Well no, they probably won't.... But since Crater Lake is a National Park the rules are a bit different, local SAR teams don't usually get invited to play, and it's NPS who manages the rescue not the county sheriff.

mreha
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Location: Portland

Re: Crater lake morons

Post by mreha » June 5th, 2016, 9:16 pm

Lurch wrote:
mreha wrote:Pretty sure they'll have to pay for the rescue, which will be astronomical...although to be fair, stupidity doesn't seem to be confined to any particular generation.
Well no, they probably won't.... But since Crater Lake is a National Park the rules are a bit different, local SAR teams don't usually get invited to play, and it's NPS who manages the rescue not the county sheriff.
Ah, I didn't think about the fact that it was federal...Oregon is one of the states that does allow billing for SAR and I assumed that they would exercise that in the case of blatant disregard for the rules. Pretty sure the NPS doesn't charge though.

Lurch
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Re: Crater lake morons

Post by Lurch » June 5th, 2016, 9:56 pm

We allow for it yes, but outside of Ski Patrol out of bounds rescues (which isn't technically handled by SAR), I don't believe it's ever actually been enforced in Oregon, and the SAR teams and coordinators are the ones who fight the hardest against charging people. The general public on the other hand are usually the ones trying to get money out of the people being rescued.

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BigBear
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Re: Crater lake morons

Post by BigBear » June 6th, 2016, 11:06 am

With regard to the "moron" comment about the off-trail rescuees, I'd be closer to Mark on that assessment than Steve. I tend to follow the safety rules and hike without the drugs. My motto has been "live to hike another day" and after 27,000 miles (tap my hiking pole against a log), I have yet to have a serious injury or require any rescue help. Some may think this is a boring way to explore nature, but it has worked for me and I have some great memories over the decades.

Here's a motto for that new generation (actually it's anyone in that 18-25 year old bracket) that takes the risks: Keep pushing the envelope and some day you will get licked.

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Chip Down
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Re: Crater lake morons

Post by Chip Down » June 6th, 2016, 7:55 pm

BigBear wrote:Here's a motto for that new generation (actually it's anyone in that 18-25 year old bracket) that takes the risks: Keep pushing the envelope and some day you will get licked.
Yeah. If I wanted to take the opposite position, just for the sake of argument, I could say that with every adventure I become more skilled, and less likely to get in trouble. But the thing is, we need to think about cumulative risk. Sure, my chances of getting lost/injured on any particular hike might decrease as my level of expertise increases, but my chances of needing help at some time will still increase with every trip. As an analogy, consider a guy playing Russian Roulette with a six-chamber revolver. If he survives, he moves on to a seven chamber revolver, then eight, etc. On any single round, his odds of survival are better than ever before...but ultimately, he's going to lose.

Lurch
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Re: Crater lake morons

Post by Lurch » June 7th, 2016, 7:16 am

I think you're off on your perception a little bit.. One of the biggest things that gets people in trouble is overconfidence. The people who don't know what they don't know are the ones that get in trouble, and by the time they recognize they're in trouble, it's beyond their skill level or experience to solve the problem themselves. People tend to count every win as a success, and clearly they must be getting better, but that's not always the case.

If you're doing legitimate off trail work, and you're not ready to spend what could be days in the field, while injured (usually either dominate hand, or knee/ankle to make you non-ambulatory) in whatever weather conditions may present themselves, then I would argue you aren't prepared.

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