South Sister Mystery Trail

Discussions and Trip Reports for off-trail adventures and rediscovering lost trails
eberr
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Re: South Sister Mystery Trail

Post by eberr » October 29th, 2021, 5:44 pm

There may be existing claims in Wilderness areas but NEW claims cannot filed. There is still the issue of the Oregon EQC/DEQ rules and how they apply. In today's climate a company trying to actually mine would have a very tough time as now NEPA and other regulations not applicable when some of these claims were first filed now are applicable.

The details for this are all in the article. But clearly new claims in the Three Sisters cannot be filed under the express terms of the Wilderness Act.

eberr
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Re: South Sister Mystery Trail

Post by eberr » October 29th, 2021, 5:50 pm

In reply to the USFS commentator, the ALJ decision in the Rock Mesa case found that half the claims were valid which meant they met the three part test of the Mining Act and could be patented and they had to be in order to buy them. Would have been nice to fight on and maybe invalidate the rest of claims, but the money to fight this in Court was not there and the USFS under the Reagan Administration just plain rolled over. The way to save the wilderness was to hold our breath and buy the claims. The stars were in alignment and we could do it. That's politics.

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Splintercat
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Re: South Sister Mystery Trail

Post by Splintercat » October 29th, 2021, 7:09 pm

Back when I was a student at OSU in the early 1980s I wrote an outdoors column for the Daily Barometer and did a story on a proposed mining operation on a claim that existed on Rock Mesa -- to make kitty litter, as I recall! It was quite controversial, but entirely legal, as mining is allowed in wilderness areas. Just my recollection, but it might have something to do with the trail and road traces in the area.

Tom

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bobcat
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Re: South Sister Mystery Trail

Post by bobcat » October 30th, 2021, 3:43 pm

eberr wrote:
October 29th, 2021, 5:44 pm
There may be existing claims in Wilderness areas but NEW claims cannot filed.
The link I posted references the Golden Hand Mine controversy in the River of No Return Wilderness in Idaho (2015). The national forest supervisor who wrote the justification authorized an exploratory operation that involved vehicle incursions (571 per year!), etc. into the wilderness. Environmental organizations got a judge to put a stop to this in 2016, citing NEPA, etc. The supervisor doesn't cite the 1983 amendment to the Wilderness Act, but I found that the mining company was invoking an 1880s claim to the area (obviously not originally their claim). I understand that no new claims can be filed, but it seems that any old claim (pre-1984) will do (?). Certainly, it would be very difficult these days for any such venture to succeed, but it seems they are still trying.

Yes, I'm pretty sure the active claims I've seen in Oregon wildernesses were filed before 1984. These are small operations and year by year more get abandoned.

eberr
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Re: South Sister Mystery Trail

Post by eberr » October 30th, 2021, 4:16 pm

Claims filed (located and determined valid even if not patented) may be mined with the appropriate permits from the FS. However, NEPA and other regulations may now apply and make the operation more difficult or unprofitable. Access will also be a problem. I'm told from a friend who is the Oregon Wilderness expert that one can search a BLM database (it used to be LR2000, but they’ve upgraded) to see if any claims are still extant in any wilderness. In re the Kalmiopsis, there were some claims that were going to be patented, but they were bought by a conservation buyer and extinguished.

So it goes and one must always stay vigilant.

eberr
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Re: South Sister Mystery Trail

Post by eberr » October 30th, 2021, 4:17 pm

PS: The 83 cutoff for new claims was in the original 1964 Wilderness Act. It was not a later amendment.

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Charley
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Re: South Sister Mystery Trail

Post by Charley » October 31st, 2021, 5:52 pm

Born2BBrad wrote:
October 28th, 2021, 2:24 pm
I had a grand idea to get a bunch or Greenies together and make a whole bunch of claims to keep others from making claims.
That's truly an excellent idea, but be careful: you could end up having the claim invalidated. . . or in jail!

https://reason.com/2019/11/18/why-dont- ... the-rules/
Believe it or not, I barely ever ride a mountain bike.

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retired jerry
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Re: South Sister Mystery Trail

Post by retired jerry » November 1st, 2021, 6:00 am

interesting article Charley, thanks

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Born2BBrad
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Re: South Sister Mystery Trail

Post by Born2BBrad » November 1st, 2021, 9:00 am

Charley wrote:
October 31st, 2021, 5:52 pm
Born2BBrad wrote:
October 28th, 2021, 2:24 pm
I had a grand idea to get a bunch or Greenies together and make a whole bunch of claims to keep others from making claims.
That's truly an excellent idea, but be careful: you could end up having the claim invalidated. . . or in jail!

https://reason.com/2019/11/18/why-dont- ... the-rules/
Fantastic information Charley! Thanks.

It looks like people much smarter than me have tried similar tactics, to varying levels of success. Maybe my best contribution to acts like this is continuing to contribute donations to conservation groups. One man can only do so much, but organizations can accomplish much more if given the resources.
Make now always the most precious time. Now will never come again.
- Jean Luc Picard

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Charley
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Re: South Sister Mystery Trail

Post by Charley » November 1st, 2021, 10:55 am

Born2BBrad wrote:
November 1st, 2021, 9:00 am
It looks like people much smarter than me have tried similar tactics, to varying levels of success. Maybe my best contribution to acts like this is continuing to contribute donations to conservation groups. One man can only do so much, but organizations can accomplish much more if given the resources.
Spoken like a true institutionalist. :)
Believe it or not, I barely ever ride a mountain bike.

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