Eagle Creek Trail (Gorge) Closed by Fire (July 5)

[mattisnotfrench]

Rep. Walden has already introduced a bill that would expedite restoration. I haven't read it in detail but what I read from second-hand sources is that some environmental processes would be bypassed in order to expedite salvage logging. For much of the fire area, wouldn't that require adding new roads?

It's total BS. He doesn't want the "timber value" wasted, and its value is needed to "pay for reforestation." He definitely wants wilderness protections put aside while this happens. That's a bad precedent to set...

The proper term for this is the shock doctrine.

[retired jerry]

You mean they're taking advantage of the fire to log in a Wilderness area?

[Webfoot]

“You never want a serious crisis to go to waste. And what I mean by that is an opportunity to do things that you think you could not do before.”

― Rahm Emanuel

[aircooled]

The proper term for this is the shock doctrine.

I haven't listened to Clyde Lewis (Ground Zero on KXL) lately, but it wouldn't surprise to hear some conspiracy theories floated. Like that the fire was an inside job and some unnamed teens get the blame. Notice that nobody has been arrested.

Why would somebody do this? To be able to push through draconian new land use laws. Maybe parts of the Gorge become limited entry areas. (They did this on Mt. St. Helens.) Or some parts become off-limits: a dozen new Perdition trails. Keep in mind, Friends of the Gorge has stated in position papers that they believe hikers have a negative environmental impact in the Gorge.

[retired jerry]

The Mt St Helens eruption was an inside job?

I don't think they actively do something like start a fire, but they do take advantage of the opportunity

Conservatives will want to do something like log the Wlderness

Liberals maybe prohibit humans from entering the Wilderness?

[Bosterson]

The proper term for this is the shock doctrine.

I haven't listened to Clyde Lewis (Ground Zero on KXL) lately, but it wouldn't surprise to hear some conspiracy theories floated. Like that the fire was an inside job and some unnamed teens get the blame. Notice that nobody has been arrested.

Why would somebody do this? To be able to push through draconian new land use laws. Maybe parts of the Gorge become limited entry areas. (They did this on Mt. St. Helens.) Or some parts become off-limits: a dozen new Perdition trails. Keep in mind, Friends of the Gorge has stated in position papers that they believe hikers have a negative environmental impact in the Gorge.

Is this a serious statement you're making? Are you actually suggesting conspiracy theories, or are you satirizing them? The Shock Doctrine is an economic concept wherein politicians take advantage of natural disasters to push through neoliberal economic reform (privatization, selling of public assets, opening trade borders, allowing outside investment, etc). Matt is making reference to it in the context of Rep Greg Walden's proposal that wilderness protections be weakened in order to allow salvage logging in the burned areas. The Shock Doctrine has nothing to do with conspiracy theories, which in general have a very poor record for actually being true.

[Guy]

The Mt St Helens eruption was an inside job?

I don't think they actively do something like start a fire, but they do take advantage of the opportunity

Conservatives will want to do something like log the Wlderness

Liberals maybe prohibit humans from entering the Wilderness?

Agreed need to keep an eye on both sides who may want to use this crisis to further their own beliefs / agenda.

[Guy]

Matt is making reference to it in the context of Rep Greg Walden's proposal that wilderness protections be weakened in order to allow salvage logging in the burned areas.

Does anyone have a link to Greg Walden's actual proposal that includes weakening wilderness protections? If so can you share it please.

All I have been able to find is second and third hand accounts from other people saying this is what he wants to do.

[Peabody]

Does anyone have a link to Greg Walden's actual proposal that includes weakening wilderness protections? If so can you share it please

https://www.congress.gov/bill/115th-con ... /3715/text

[retired jerry]

a little hard to interpret that

it says a "response activity" includes salvage logging and reforestation

within 30 days a response activity proposal has to be made

the public input, lawsuits, etc. are restricted

it says reforestation has to be achieved over 75% of the impacted area. Does this include salvage logging?

nowhere does it talk about Wilderness and whether it's okay to salvage log and reforest there. Since they don't talk about this, and much of the National Scenic Area is Wilderness, it seems like they're saying in this bill this doesn't matter, go ahead and salvage log/reforest